Macchi Finish Question

GAJouette · Post by **GAJouette** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 8:26 am

Good Morning All,
The first of my Macchi 202 prototype is nearly finished.To date she's in aluminum and yellow primer and still lacking finishing details.My question is was the prototype finished in painted aluminum or natural metal?Combing through my refferences I've found it mentioned as being both painted in aluminum and natural metal finishes.My original idea was to finish her in a natural metal finish because I thought it would be more interesting to the eye.However once the first coats of aluminum were down it looks pretty good too.Pardon my AMS here but I want the finish to be historically correct as possible,thus my confusion.Thank you in advance for your input.
Regards,
Gregory Jouette

Post by **Editor** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:29 am

Can’t wait to see it! A natural metal C.202 and a C.205 are on my lists of things to do. Good question. The prototype was finished in a natural metal with primer, it is believed, painted on the forward part (engine) of the plane. The rudder was painted in the prewar green-white-red stripes (as you know I’m sure). Regarding natural metal, aluminum is by definition a metal, so either choice, aluminum or natural metal, you won't be faulted although you can choose panels from photos and finish those panels in either an aluminum or natural metal to reflect the natural shades and grains of the metal. The C.202 was constructed from aluminum/duraluminum.

GAJouette · Post by **GAJouette** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:51 am

Vince,
Perhaps I wasn't clear with my question.From my references,it was either painted with aluminum paint or left in natural metal (unpainted).From the few photos of the prototype it's impossible for my eyes to tell the difference.I'll try to post a photo of the unfinished prototype tonight for you ,and thanks for your input.
Highest Regards,
Gregory Jouette

Post by **Editor** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:39 am

Hi Gregory, the prototype was left unpainted except for the front of the plane which some speculate was painted in a primer during the first test flights. Fabric covered surfaces were likely painted in an aluminum dope and dope as you know creates an air tight seal for lift or control. I don't believe the C.202 prototype was painted over aluminum or at least I haven't come across anything mentioning this. Early Cr.32s were famously painted in an aluminum dope (the fabric covered areas that is) but not the C.202 prototype.

GAJouette · Post by **GAJouette** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 3:48 pm

Vince,
Sorry to be such a pain. Here's a quote concerning the prototype's finish,"A photograph of the prototype of the Folgare taken while it still had a natural metal coat of paint and tricolour on the tail".This was taken from Macchi MC202 Folgare pt.1 by Maurizio Di Terlizzi.All the other finish infomation reports a natural metal finish ie unpainted. It's the reason for my confusion, conflicting information.I hope Maurizio will chime in on this question. I suppose my confusion could stem from the translation from Italian and English.Thanks again my friend,take care up there in the Great White North.
Highest Regards,
Gregory Jouette

Post by **Editor** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 5:20 pm

Hi Gregory, ask away, there is a case to be made that the plane might have been painted with a light/metal paint because on close inspection of the photo of the prototype at the Macchi works (no MM number at this time), there doesn't appear to be a sheen you would expect from a natural unpainted aircraft. However the same aircraft was later sent to Guidona (MM.445) and painted in the poached egg camo scheme for evaluations. I can't imagine Macchi painting the aircraft twice. One clue is in the photo on p.4 Squadron Signal No.41 of the prototype and its clear from the landing gear doors that the plane appears to be unpainted, the undersides, as does the radiator. I like this question because we can never be sure until we see some documented evidence specifically stating the aircraft was unpainted by Macchi itself. Yes it would be nice if Maurizio could weight in here, or just PM him

GAJouette · Post by **GAJouette** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:24 pm

Vince,
Here's a little teaser for you.

Post by **Editor** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:30 pm

dammnnn, that looks nice! Article please! wow! You did a great job and even got the headrest correct.

GAJouette · Post by **GAJouette** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:50 pm

Vince,
Many thanks my friend.The paint job is as per the drawing you posted earlier for me ,last year I believe.As for an article,sure why not.But I would prefer to include Version II (Full Camouflage) too.Version II is being worked at the same time as Version I,just alittle behind. Before I forget the paint so far meant to show painted aluminum,not for a natural metal finish I need to add contrasting panels.
Highest Regards,
Gregory Jouette

Post by **Editor** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:56 pm

Ok Gregory. Its beautiful, the plane really came out nice - its a winner! Do you have the profile and reference pics for the prototype that was sent to Guidonia? I'm not sure if I posted the poached egg profile of MM.445 or not.

GAJouette · Post by **GAJouette** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 8:49 pm

Vince,
Yes I do,And thanks again .
Highest Regards,
Gregory Jouette

macchi205 · Post by **macchi205** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 2:05 am

Hello everybody, regarding the posts about the C.202 prototype, I would like to thanks Gregory for sharing with us his beautiful work, really very very nice. I confirm my opinion that this prototype wasn't painted, fuselage metal sheets were natural metal, with a finish more or less satin, because of the fact that these sheets were bonded, nailed and stressed to conform the fuselage shape. Primered parts were in the typical Macchi's anticorrosive green, or a similar primire color, between green and yellow.

A little curiosity: do you know that Agusta (World's greatest helicopter company) and Aermacchi STILL use verde Anticorrosione (or an absolutely similar color) for their composite resin parts ?

So I think that the one realized by Gregory is a little bit yellower. But.... we haven't any color picture, all we state is coming from records, documents...nothing concrete. I am now working on a Fiat G.55 in 32nd scale, the one preserved in Vigna di valle museum is painted a Yellow anticorrosive inside ! I know the people that restored it with original manual in the original factory and original documents and original wartime people that worked on the assembly line line: they SWEAR that it was yellow !
Last month I had the opportunity to examine an original G59, with Gray interiors, well: where the paint was chipped, the original Yellow come out !

So if I were Gregory, I will mask the yellow on, and spray a mix of Verde anticorrosione and yellow, in soft and thinned strokes, then I would mask some of the fuselage panel and give them a light coat of satin varnish.
That's all, so you'll have an "officially" realized Prototype, with different size, appearance and glare panels and with "officially documented" primered parts.
Good luck and look forward to see your beautiful Macchi.

GAJouette · Post by **GAJouette** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 8:45 am

Maurizio,
It's great to hear from you and thank you for your kind words.I'll take your advice on the natural metal finish,the method you described using satin varnish sounds very good to me.Originally I had thought of using different shades of aluminum on some panels for the natural metal finish.But it would much more apparent than the method you describe,which would be much more subtle. Trying to be as realistic as possible.As for the yellowish primer being too yellow,I also thought it just didn't look right when compaired to the yellow used on the restored Fiat G.55.To date I'm still debating whether to repaint with a very thin green wash or as you suggest repainting with a mixure of yellow/verde anticorrosione.I believe I have to test them both out on scrap plactic card stock.
Again Thank you for your time and effort to help a fellow modeler.It is very much appreciated and your excellent books too. I'm looking forward to seeing and reading about your model projects posted here on Stormo.
Highest Regards,
Gregory Jouette

Vincent Biondi · Post by **Vincent Biondi** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:38 am

Hi Gregory,
Wow!
Looking reallllllllll.... good!!
Vincent.

Post by **Editor** » Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:38 am

Adding to Maurizio's reply, here's another scan of the profile of the prototype (ref. Ali e Colori #4). The primed panels approach a lime-green color, even a little more green than is shown here (for whatever reason my HP Scanjet turns the greens to yellow). In the original scan I posted, the primed area scanned too yellow and is why Gregory finished the area in that color. One final note, I'm not sure the orginal photograph support the landing gear doors painted in a primer.

http://stormomagazine.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=341