MC.200 369-1 Giovanni Borzoni

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hokusai
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MC.200 369-1 Giovanni Borzoni

Post by hokusai » Tue Jan 30, 2024 2:04 pm

Following the profile in "Ali e colori 2" this machine is often modelled with the poached egg Macchi style camo. I wonder if this is correct.

In "Ali a colori" (by Matteo Cornelius Sullivan, YouCanPrint, 2021) page 63, some photos look rather like a Breda style camo. Actually, a camo very similar to the machine displayed in Vigna del Valle can be seen.
MC200-VignaSmall.jpg
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Could this be a green coat over the original poached egg?

What is your opinion, guys?

No sure if I am allowed to post a scan from the book. I guess you know that publication, right?

Thanks

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Re: MC.200 369-1 Giovanni Borzoni

Post by Editor » Wed Jan 31, 2024 7:55 am

The C.200 at Vigna di Valle was built by AerMacchi in Sept 1941 and little is known about its wartime record. At the time of the armistice it was with 8o Gruppo and then taken over by the Co-belligerent AF and used as a trainer until late 1944. After the war it was repainted red upper surfaces and gray lower surfaces with AMI roundels added. The plane sat around and exposure to the elements eventually revealed the original camouflage scheme: it was painted at the factory with Verde mottles over a Giallo base (the Serie Mimetica colors). The cowling was yellow - Spring-Oct 1941 planes were painted with a yellow identification band on the cowling. This plane was restored in the mid-70s and has been coded and painted differently over the years. At one point it was painted VOS2 (VM?) with yellow fuselage band (USSR?) and yellow cowling and coded 359-8.

If you don't plan to make a copy of the book you listed above and sell it to make money for yourself then copyright laws don't restrict you from posting pages on this or any other forum for discussion or educational purposes. btw "Ali a colori" doesn't translate to anything meaningful although we should acknowledge the authors interest in the topic and the effort he may have put into the book. I don't know anything about the book or the author.

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Re: MC.200 369-1 Giovanni Borzoni

Post by hokusai » Wed Jan 31, 2024 10:02 am

Thanks for your reply,

"Ali a colori" means "Wings in color". The book is a collection of color photos. Some are colored b&w and also captionned as such, some are real color.

Here is the plane I am interested in. None of the 3 has a useful caption.
Although not mentionned, I suspect these are colored b&w. Whatsoever, 1 and 2 don't look like poached egg style camo, while 3 maybe(?)
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3.jpg
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3.jpg
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Re: MC.200 369-1 Giovanni Borzoni

Post by Editor » Wed Jan 31, 2024 1:21 pm

1 & 2 are the same machine at Vigna di Valle. 3 is a known photo of C.200 369-1 at Stalino in Sept 1941 with the poached-egg camo scheme. There's a well known color photo (the front cover of the CMPR color guide) of a line up of eight Macchi + Breda built machines, from afar the camo schemes on the 3 Macchi built C.200s nearest the camera look like the criss-crossing pattern of 1 and 2 but when you zoom in, the poached-egg camo scheme is clearly visible.

A better photo (the original B&W) of Borzoni's machine is in ADI #8 with chipped paint on the starboard side fuselage however the poached-egg scheme is visible.

I get it that the author wanted to say wings in color but he should have said "Ali in colori", "in" means the same thing in Italian.

Here's Luca's build of this plane as a reference:

https://www.stormomagazine.com/ModelArt ... LB_1a.html

The thing to note in Luca's build is the marrone mimetico that covers almost all of the giallo mimetico splotches.

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AerMacchi "Poached Eggs"

Post by RetiredInKalifornia » Wed Jan 31, 2024 7:29 pm

Here's sample photos of one of my Special Hobby Macchi C.200 builds in CMPR Schema C8 "Poached Egg":

Image

Image

Image

Image

The CMPR guide says colors: Verde Mimetico 2, Giallo Mimetico 4, Bruno Mimetico, Grigio Mimetico but description is: Macchie rade Giallo e Marrone Mimetico su fondo Verde Mimetico that underlined translating as "brown spots camouflage" to me meaning Bruno Mimetico. Anyway, I'd painted Schema C8 Macchi C.200 & C.202 models with Marrone Mimetico 2, Maronne Mimetico 53192 & Bruno Mimetico.
Last edited by RetiredInKalifornia on Thu Feb 01, 2024 1:11 am, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: MC.200 369-1 Giovanni Borzoni

Post by hokusai » Wed Jan 31, 2024 7:42 pm

So we can assume that 369-1 in photo 1/2 vs 3 are either different machines or repainted?
We note also that the Scarabocchio insignia under the cockpit is different.

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Re: MC.200 369-1 Giovanni Borzoni

Post by Editor » Wed Jan 31, 2024 8:25 pm

1&2 are the Vigna di Valle machine, the photos were probably photoshoped (aged) but its not the same plane as 3 in its original livery. Below are two photos of the C.200 at Vigna in its hangar, compare the port side view camo (below) to 1. The starboard view 2 shows no chipping as in 3. 1&2 and 3 are different machines. 3 is a colorized version of the b&w original. There was no factory criss-cross pattern like the plane at Vigna, that's a made up camo scheme during restoration.

Image

Image

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Look At The Nardi Behind the Saetta...

Post by RetiredInKalifornia » Thu Feb 01, 2024 1:14 am

Similar camo scheme though with wider "criss-cross" pattern, both possibly repainted around same time - ?

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Re: MC.200 369-1 Giovanni Borzoni

Post by hokusai » Thu Feb 01, 2024 11:26 am

Editor wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2024 8:25 pm
1&2 are the Vigna di Valle machine, the photos were probably photoshoped (aged)
Ok, now I got it :thumbup: Thank you for debunking the fake 1&2.
RetiredInKalifornia wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2024 7:29 pm
Here's sample photos of one of my Special Hobby Macchi C.200 builds in CMPR Schema C8 "Poached Egg"
A beauty! I feel envious of the detailed productions displayed on this site. My models are tiny 1/200 game tokens, barely visible on the table with my fading eyesight :lol:

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Thank You...

Post by RetiredInKalifornia » Thu Feb 01, 2024 2:07 pm

hokusai wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2024 11:26 am
RetiredInKalifornia wrote:
Wed Jan 31, 2024 7:29 pm
Here's sample photos of one of my Special Hobby Macchi C.200 builds in CMPR Schema C8 "Poached Egg"
A beauty! I feel envious of the detailed productions displayed on this site. My models are tiny 1/200 game tokens, barely visible on the table with my fading eyesight :lol:
...Fortunately my eyesight is decent, age 71 last year passed the California Department of Motor Vehicles Driver License Renewal testing with one error (obscure question I'd not seen before in 54 years) acing the eye test first time since 1973, hearing is going but don't expect to need aids till age 80.

Photos of built models always look better than seeing Real McCoy's, 1965 started buying scale model publications, photos of airplanes in particular bloody terrible then compared to contemporary ones up on the Internet! I've gotta believe those Real McCoy's were awful to begin with, this before better hobby paints, third-party decals & authoritative research on aircraft types, camouflage & markings particularly for Italian aircraft came widely available decades later.

For me going back to 1965 in a time machine without benefit of the research never mind third-party decals trying to build the tiny handful of Italian aircraft subject model kits then available is futile, "clocking" to mid-1970s lot more subjects in 1/72nd scale but no "off-road" subjects ala CANSA FC.20, Savoia Marchetti S.78 etc. yet. My "timing" mistake was not starting Italian subject kit building before 2006, should had resumed when I'd retired from work in 2000, would had snagged a much pined for CANT Z.1018, oh well!

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