Red Stripes on wings in Ethiopia

pbhawkin · Post by **pbhawkin** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 7:34 pm

Hi all,
Were the Red stripes on the upper wings painted over the normal colour of the plane with that normal colour between the Red stripes or was White painted between the stripes?
I want to make a decal for a set of these stripes and don't know if I should have them Red and White or Red and clear.
I do have the Ali D'Italia book on the Ro.43/44 but it doesn't clear this up.

Thanks in advance for clearing this up.

modeldad · Post by **modeldad** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:43 pm

They were applied over the normal "Ivory" color. IIRC, they were used as a quick way to locate a downed aircraft.

Not much different from the use of the red color on Arctic aircraft.

pbhawkin · Post by **pbhawkin** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:55 pm

Steven,
Thanks for the reply and information.
The plane I am modelling is the IMAM Ro.43 and as such was shipbound not shore based. My understanding is that these Naval aircraft were Light Grey all over with Black for the underwater parts. And the Red stripes would therefore have light Grey between them on the top wing and not 'Ivory' as on the land based planes.
Can you (or anyone) else confirm this?

modeldad · Post by **modeldad** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 6:42 pm

Came across this :

http://www.superaereo.com/imam.html

Industrie Meccaniche Aeronautiche Meridionali's most widely used aircraft were the Romeo Ro.37/43 reconnaissance/observation aircraft. Other aircraft included the Ro.44 naval fighter, Ro.41 light trainer and the Ro.57 twin-engined fighter.

IMAM Romeo 43. This is a navalised version of the IMAM Ro 37bis, designed to be catapulted from the deck of Italy's principal Navy ships. Nearly all were aluminium dope overall, with anti-camoflage stripes on the upper surfaces of the wings. Originally available under the Airmodel and Aviation USK labels, the Octopus kit is a much better bet, being a much closer match to the plans found in the Ali d'Italia book than the other two. There was a 1/48th resin kit made by Lilium, but current availabilty is unknown.

Chris Busbridge · Post by **Chris Busbridge** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:07 am

In the latter part of Italy's WWII participation, the marine aircraft had their the overall silver scheme replaced with dark grey upper surfaces and light grey under surfaces. The red stripes were abandoned.

pbhawkin · Post by **pbhawkin** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 2:40 am

Steven,
Thanks for the link great info and pics.
Chris hi,
But what about the pre-war colours of the planes as in the Eithiopian war especially the naval aircraft which I believe were light grey and not the silver/natural dope/Ivory of the land based planes.

modeldad · Post by **modeldad** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 9:53 am

Is there a specific reference or picture for the use of the Ro. 43 in Ethiopia or Somalia?

I went through "Ali Italiane in Africa Orientale: 1935 -1940" and find no reference to the Ro. 43.

The Ro. 37bis was used extensively, perhaps there was confusion.

Post by **Editor** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 10:32 am

The following was sent in by Riccardo and establishes the upper wing paint scheme as well as the well known tri-colors that appeared on the top wings of some RA aircraft e.g., Fiat CR.32:

"The Disposizione C.A. 490, based on UNI 287, dated 26/5/1934 foresaw the following colors, used also for special parts:

1) rosso bandiera (flag red) for fire protection tools similar to Rosso 9
2) verde bandiera (flag green)for engine cooling water pipes similar to
verde8
3) bianco neve (snow white) for oxygen pipes

The white and red strips on the upper wing surfaces of aircraft were introduced in the Foglio (paper/directive) 24171 dated 21/10/1938 and Foglio 13775 dated 8/11/1938."

pbhawkin · Post by **pbhawkin** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 5:09 pm

Hi guys and again thanks for the information.
The Ali D'Italia book no 12 on the Ro.43/44 only has colour profiles and a picture of a model in colour the rest of the photos are black and white. It is very hard to tell from the colour profiles if the lighter colour aircraft are supposed to be Silver or light Grey!
The model has White and Red stripes on what looks like a Silver/Aluminium finish.
The Black and White photos suggest that there was NO White between the Red stripes but rather the colour of the aircraft (maybe!?).
It would seem as though the colour 'F3' as found in the 'Color guide' on this site under table 'F':
http://www.stormomagazine.com/RegiaAero ... WII_3a.htm

"Uniforme per aerei da addestramento, collegamento, siluranti, caccia imbarcati"

is what the seaplanes used after 1936 and it was Silver/Aluminium (G2) up to then

Uniforme per tutti gli aerei fino al 1936

.
The colour scheme then went to a dark Grey (F2) from 1941 (as per the writing under Naval planes) but no date apppears in the table for this change over (Table F).

So, I think I am happy to paint my Ro43 as a light Grey (Grigio Azzurro Chiaro 1) as being between 1937 and 1941 and with the Tri-colour on the tail appearing up to the beginning of WW2 (I guess when Italy entered the war in May 1940?).
SO that just leaves whether there was White or natural aircraft colour between the Red stripes??

Regards
Peter

Post by **Editor** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 10:38 pm

pbhawkin wrote: ... with the Tri-colour on the tail appearing up to the beginning of WW2 (I guess when Italy entered the war in May 1940?).
SO that just leaves whether there was White or natural aircraft colour between the Red stripes??

On June 12 1940 during the invasion of France, Directive B13842 was issued which ordered the removal of the tricolors from the rudders of RA aircraft to be replaced with the white cross of Savoy. It was felt that the national rudder colors were too similar to the French ones.

Below is a Ro.43 aboard the Zara, note the top wings are painted white and the anti-camouflage stripes applied overtop.

pbhawkin · Post by **pbhawkin** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 10:49 pm

Vince,
Lovely photo (I have not seen that one before), I wonder what date it was taken?.
Yes, the photo does seem to show that the top wing was White with Red stripes.
Pity the tail of the aircraft can not be seen.
Anyway, looks like I will have Red AND White stripes on the top wing along with Light Grey everywhere else and Black for the underwater areas.

Thanks for the information.

Chris Busbridge · Post by **Chris Busbridge** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:33 pm

It looks as if these red/white stripes were unique to the Ro43. Looking at photos of other naval aircraft of the same era (Z.506 and Z.501), only red stripes can be seen on the overall silver finish.

This would also appear to be true for the red stripes applied to the ivory coloured schemes seen on Ro.1, Ca.111, Ca.133, Ro.37 etc. Saying that, there was a Ro.37 which had a red and white striped scheme applied over the whole airframe, but I believe it was a unique example.

pbhawkin · Post by **pbhawkin** » Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:46 pm

Chris,
hi.
Do you have any pics you can post or links to same of those planes?

Post by **Editor** » Wed Sep 17, 2008 7:27 pm

pbhawkin wrote:Vince,
Lovely photo (I have not seen that one before), I wonder what date it was taken?.
Yes, the photo does seem to show that the top wing was White with Red stripes.
Pity the tail of the aircraft can not be seen.
Anyway, looks like I will have Red AND White stripes on the top wing along with Light Grey everywhere else and Black for the underwater areas.

Thanks for the information.

See the photo below, taken aboard the battleship Conte di Cavour 1937 - Ro.43. Note the tricolored tail which extended to the rudder as well as the upper wing white and red stripes. ADI #12, p.13.

pbhawkin · Post by **pbhawkin** » Wed Sep 17, 2008 7:37 pm

Vince,
Belissimo!
Great photo (pit it is not colour!).
I must recheck my copy as I had missed that picture!!!

Out of interest are the 'mini-series' books much different from the regular Ali d'Italia books?